IBNLive > IBNLive Chat

Refresh

BALVINDER:and why women are so happy about its repletion as section 377 does not consider lesbianism a crime. even to make a person culpable of the gay offence under section 377 'penetration' has to be proved

: Interesting. I will leave that answer to lawyers and woman LGBT activists. I think women with a lesbian orientation will be happy because they can openly expressed their sexual preference. Thanks everybody for a frank and candid discussion though it would have been nice if we could discuss scriptures and perspective changes in some Christian schools of thought.

sudhi234:Diptosh Sir, after all its media which is responsible for giving publicity which resulted in current controversies on section 377, why are we linking somebody's rights to religion?

: I think media has give justified publicity to an issue which needed to come to the fore and not be concealed forever in the folds of our civilization. We are just discussing in this context that religions should not be allowed to interfere with personal space.

Ricky:I think religion as an idea has become irrelevant in a way that it is in complete denial of human rights of people different from the stereotyped image it forms about individuals. Denial & doubt can't be the way towards God as marked by almost all modern religions. Homosexuality occurs in nature & is not limited to humans only. It isso true that the first step in correcting your mistakes is accepting them.Alas! religious leaders can't fathom this simple sense of conventional wisdom.

: You couldn't be more right. Only my counsel is that don't use the umbrella term - religion. It's rather we say that collective religion is becoming a dehumanised phenomenon. It is promoting bigotry and irrational beliefs. Personal religion provides the only space for a person to be deeply spiritual and at peace with himself.

Karthik.B.S:Sir, we talk about religion and homosexuality and we fail to see the abundance of homosexual references in our history thorough Khajurao and other sources. Why such a big fuss on it? Agreed that this practice might spread unwanted diseases, but I don't think no one can question a persons' orientation. Let them free and do whatever they want. I think it is natural. Please let us know what is the Political side of it, if any. The Congress, always, is more worried about its vote bank.

: You are right. The government is very worried. The Health Minister, Ghulam Nabi Azad is uncomfortable. Home Minister Chidambaram is in its favour but cannot openly say it. Law Minister Veerappa Moily is being clever. He is studying everybody's opinion and basically being a fence sitter. Nobody wants to take a call. But I believe the government will find it very difficult to overrule the Delhi High Court verdict. It will be a regressive decision and adversely impact India's image internationally.

NarayananS:How will the goverment react/or does the center have to take any step to in this direction regards Narayan

: I think I have answered this question already. The government will tread the path of caution and will definitely try to build a consensus in favour of the High court verdict. That is the initial indication we are receiving from the government.

Priymrita Chatterjee:In our Hindu religion there is already the existance of Brihannala & Shikhandi. So the religion has nothing to do with this section. But my question is, do you thing that we the Indians are enough matured, moral and aware for this section 377 to be used properly?

: I can understand the first part of your statement. But cannot make out what you are trying to ask.

ashwin reddy:there are many things india to deal with like poverty etc. why is everyone so keen about this matter? and there are almost 40% of the students (in india not students who go to other countries) who live far away from their parents and study, if gay sex is decriminalized then these youngsters think this as a new entertainment. what is you comment on this? and on sundays with family we like to go to a park sit peacefully there and cit chat and in that situation if you see a gay couple not far away from us. do we feel comfortable? and i say, there are many thing which we have to keep in mind before giving a judgment.

: Agree with you that there are more important issue. But what would you have felt if you were told that straight sex was a criminal activity. That is why removing consensual sex from Section 377 is such an important issue to the gay movement. And as for your fears, I think you are forgetting that despite instances of sodomy in places like prison cells, you cannot change a human being's sexual orientation. He can be gay, straight or bisexual.

crusader:Being a gay or homosexual is a different thing and being a Eunuch is completely different. Why are the latter joining into this debate? Why are they supporting this cause? Is the law only for people with homosexual orientation or is it for those who are males and females both? Kindly clarify.

: I will have to check out on this. The world over, when you say gay rights you broadly mean LGBT rights (Lesbian-Gay-Bisexual and Transgender) rights. I should have come prepared on the eunuch issue. Sorry, I am not well-versed with the subject.

Sanjay:Diptosh : In many countries , including USA , same sex marriages are not permitted in most states , whats the next step given that Sec 377 may eventually be deleted for consesnsual sex ? Will gays in India push for recognition of same sex marriages ?

: They might but they must realize that societies don't hurry like sprinters wanting to breast the tape. They'll have to slow down, first let this big change sink in and then slowly build up their struggle for the same sex marriage.

pc:Do you think that we Indians are ready to accept such cultural shocks? thank you.

: There was a point of time when the society was forced to accept widow-remarriage or even agree that Sati as crime. Gay relationships have persisted through the ages. We are now giving a socially acceptable status.

Suryakant Pandey:Mr Diptosh- If you agree with the Honourable Court's Verdict, then would you also be agreeing if similar court passes a favourable judgement on Legalization of Prostitution in future? (I see a connect with both the scenarios)

: I don't see a connect with the scenarios. I will try to answer your question if you point out what connect you are noticing between the two.

Akshay Rajagopalan:When will people understand that the Delhi Court has only decriminalized homosexuality, and not encouraged, advocated, or championed it?

: You have travelled far enough to make fine distinctions. Let the society first wake up to the fact that gays are not dirty sinners, that they are normal human beings only with a minority sexual orientation.

piyush:Is it not that changes in section 377 promoting Gay sex? The people who were hiding earlier dont you think they will also come up in the picture that they are gays?

: Absolutely. That's the basic purpose. Sir, you don't have to tell anyone that you are naturally born straight man. That's a given. Why wouldn't a person born gay have the same right. We need the gays to come out. So, left to me, I am against exhibitionism of any sort.

noamaan shaikh:We are supposed to be a free country with equal rights to everyone regardless of their sexual preferences, Why should religious groups like Darul Uloom oppose this? i guess they should concentrate on illiteracy and ignorance which is so prevalent amongst the muslims in India.

: Yes all religious groups are opposing it. Homosexuality has been opposed in all the Abrahamic religions --- religions like Judaism, Islam and Christianity. In India, the Hindu scriptures were somewhat ambivalent, though in recent times the Hindu spiritual leaders have tended to be anti-gay for reasons which don't have satisfactory answers. Agree with you that Dar-ul-uloom should concentrate on education than personal sexual preferences.

mohit:frankly, do you think Indian society is ready for this change? isnt the media going overboard with this campaign? espcially the english media campaign?

: You haven't told us Mohit where you stand on the gay question. If a stand is right, the media has to take it up. In today's time, it is proven beyond doubt that homosexuality is a natural orientation. It is not a curable disease as some religious leaders are insisting with all their bigotry and obscurantism. If a policy is just, it has to be pushed even if the society is not ready for it.

gaurav:I think this ruling by the court is a very welcome gesture of the individual freedom of a person and it was widely awaited one also. Now when all the religious authority have came together (with their bogus and irrational arguments) to oppose it , what do you think is going to happen? How much momentum and support they can generate and how crucial that will be in deciding the future of not only laws related to homosexuality but all the rulings which doesn't accord with religious dogma? specially considering that being a secular state, Indian constitution doesn't give any authority or power to religious groups in deciding such matters.

: The government has to be firm and accept the progressive standpoint. Gays cannot be criminals in the 21 st century. Imagine in Poland gays were decriminalized in 1833, in Britain in 1867, we are already half a century behind. But an ancient civilization like India giving a thumbs up to gay rights will mean a lot to the worldwide gay movement.

nkc:what is sec. 377 why it is so disputed??

: It's because it discriminated against gays and looked at homosexuality as crime. What the Delhi High Court has done is it has retained Section 377 but has permitted consensual same sex between persons above the age of eighteen.

gaurav:The whole issue is based on the debate whether choice of sexual partner is inherent in each individual's biology (genes) or it is matter of choice and upbringing in the society, family,culture. I am not expecting a binary answer for this but which view do you agree with more and to what extent? Whatever limited knowledge I have about science (specially recent developments after the 80's in the fields of cognitive neuroscience, psychology) it's not a matter of choice at all and human biology has to with it. A very vast majority of population is born straight and a minority of it is not. It is same as if compared to left handed-right handed population , its not a matter of choice. If this is the case why don't all the open minded intellectual , writers , scientist like amartya sen , come together and talk about it? Why don't they together give a statement of their beliefs representing the whole community? They have done this in the cases like iraq invasion then why is this topic considered a taboo ?It affects the lives of 1-2 % of the population(20 million approximately)

: You have said everything I would have said. Being a gay is a natural orientation. Gay sex like straight sex needs to be wholly consensual. Since it is a personal orientation, it's as you rightly put it just a matter of natural inclination, like some people are southpaws by birth. I agree with you gay rights activists should not have been left alone to fight their battle in the past. In San Francisco, it wasn't just Harvey Milk's battle. Sympathetic and right-minded straight people should have come forward long. After all, they are majority. A society is always best guided by its liberal majority.

D.R.Gulati:1.Why is the media going overboard on the Section 377 verdict, when it's the elite which is in the fore front,not the aam aadmi? 2.Whenever the government is in a catch 22 situation ,like it's opinion on the matter,it side tracks it in the name of 'consensus'.Why? 3.If religion and the verdict are not in conflict,why the hulla baalu?

: You must realize that the gay among the elite have at least found a voice to state their viewpoints and perspectives. The aam aadmi spends his entire life virtually in hiding. Unless the elite raises its voice , the aam aadmi will not be able to reap the benefits. Besides, Section 377 was a big victory. Media had every reason to play it. Till now being a gay and being a criminal was the same thing. True, the law was never exercise in practice against the case but at least it's a huge change in definition and attitude.

Naima Krishnan:Mr.Majumdar, The land that we call India today has known queer sexual behaviour for ages now. Don't you think, therefore, that we must adopt the responses that ancient Indian made, viz, decriminalising queer sex and also throughly deglamourizing it, unlike what the media are doing now? Don't you also think that straight sex should be promoted as the normal way that nature intended human beings to follow?

: Fully agree with you. Only you must understand that there have been centuries of repression. As a result there could be some exhibitionism immediately after the Delhi High Court verdict. But am sure gay rights activists will understand that they will stand to lose if they go on emphasizing their sexuality.

Chat Master